Does anyone have any "hard" info on the extent of Frykowski's drug deals? :-\ I know he was a "big" user and tried many types but his dealing I have never seen any hard info on $$ or when or where. I have certainly read plenty about his dealing but ..............
[quote author=ecnivb link=topic=3102.msg25870#msg25870 date=1216682343] Mostly innuendo. I too have never seen any hard evidence. [/quote] Which could mean that the theories built on it are kicked to the curb?
[quote author=Coroner In Law link=topic=3102.msg25875#msg25875 date=1216684126] [quote author=ecnivb link=topic=3102.msg25870#msg25870 date=1216682343] Mostly innuendo. I too have never seen any hard evidence. [/quote] Which could mean that the theories built on it are kicked to the curb? [/quote] It's like a lot of things connected to the case, the people who know aren't saying. Withold (sp?) K said that Frykowski was involved in dealing, but as for hard evidence...... Maybe Polanski would know. ???
[quote author=ecnivb link=topic=3102.msg25881#msg25881 date=1216684783] [quote author=Coroner In Law link=topic=3102.msg25875#msg25875 date=1216684126] [quote author=ecnivb link=topic=3102.msg25870#msg25870 date=1216682343] Mostly innuendo. I too have never seen any hard evidence. [/quote] Which could mean that the theories built on it are kicked to the curb? [/quote] It's like a lot of things connected to the case, the people who know aren't saying. Withold (sp?) K said that Frykowski was involved in dealing, but as for hard evidence...... Maybe Polanski would know. ??? [/quote] Witold K was a corkscrew and a flake. Even the LAPD got tired of him. Polanski might but ........
Short of an arrest record, what would you consider "hard" evidence? I'm inclined to value disparate sources who independently corroborate each other. With a 40 year old case, it may be about the best you can get.
[quote author=bbm link=topic=3102.msg25888#msg25888 date=1216691300] Short of an arrest record, what would you consider "hard" evidence? I'm inclined to value disparate sources who independently corroborate each other. With a 40 year old case, it may be about the best you can get. [/quote] After all this time, I think you're right. The thing is, how many sources are there on Frykowski's drug dealing?
[quote author=ecnivb link=topic=3102.msg25889#msg25889 date=1216692439] [quote author=bbm link=topic=3102.msg25888#msg25888 date=1216691300] Short of an arrest record, what would you consider "hard" evidence? I'm inclined to value disparate sources who independently corroborate each other. With a 40 year old case, it may be about the best you can get. [/quote] After all this time, I think you're right. The thing is, how many sources are there on Frykowski's drug dealing? [/quote] I was looking at some of it and there very few actual facts and a mass of comments by individuals that don't amount to much. There was a lot of often repeated stories that were the same meaning that they probably had the same source so are worthless. The old aphorism: where there's smoke..... has some validity but there are no arrests, no trial testimony nor was any large amount of drugs found in the bedroom he shared w/ Ms. Folger.
Many of your best witnesses are highly unlikely to self incriminate. I think there's been enough from varying sources with nothing to gain that Voytek was involved in some unsavory dealings
I can only use (again) Ed Sanders' book as saying that Woijtek met his Canadian friends on Aug. 6 at the Polanski residence and he was about to meet them again on Aug. 10, so probably he was just in a preliminary process of being a drug dealer, if at all. Therefore, I don't think he had a chance to meet any of the Family members, sure not to "burn" Linda or Tex, and surely he didn't "rape" Linda as some pro-Mansonites are claiming.
[quote author=Eran link=topic=3102.msg25934#msg25934 date=1216733074] I can only use (again) Ed Sanders' book as saying that Woijtek met his Canadian friends on Aug. 6 at the Polanski residence and he was about to meet them again on Aug. 10, so probably he was just in a preliminary process of being a drug dealer, if at all. Therefore, I don't think he had a chance to meet any of the Family members, sure not to "burn" Linda or Tex, and surely he didn't "rape" Linda as some pro-Mansonites are claiming. [/quote] I think Frykowski was a major league doper but whatever Sanders writes usually had little to do with reality because he didn't see any of it. Sanders was talking to people after the fact with little or none in the way of proof. He "heard" from some people and they "told" him. The drug angle especially as it relates to motive or any connection to the Family is a non-starter.
Frykowski was going to meet the Canadians at the airport. Daniel Stanland, the pilot of said plane, was busted a few years later in what was deemed one of the biggest pot busts known at that time. Frykowski was on an MDA experiment and it is rumored that he was going to start his own MDA trade. Stanland died in the 1980's...Pic Dawson is dead.. Tommy Harrigan went on the lamb and had dealings with the Stop Watch Gang...and Billy Doyle is still with us.
[quote author=catscradle77 link=topic=3102.msg25939#msg25939 date=1216734784] Frykowski was going to meet the Canadians at the airport. Daniel Stanland, the pilot of said plane, was busted a few years later in what was deemed one of the biggest pot busts known at that time. Frykowski was on an MDA experiment and it is rumored that he was going to start his own MDA trade. Stanland died in the 1980's...Pic Dawson is dead.. Tommy Harrigan went on the lamb and had dealings with the Stop Watch Gang...and Billy Doyle is still with us. [/quote] Right! but none of those people were the killers and they didn't know the Family. So where do we look for more?
Coroner, saying what you have said regarding Sanders is like sayin every documentary, every book, every biography and every recount of events are false since the authors "weren't there" or didn't experience first-hand the events. I think no one could prove - as yet - that what Sanders or Bugliosi wrote are lies or false, so I wouldn't buy that. Sorry.
[quote author=Eran link=topic=3102.msg25999#msg25999 date=1216801886] Coroner, saying what you have said regarding Sanders is like sayin every documentary, every book, every biography and every recount of events are false since the authors "weren't there" or didn't experience first-hand the events. I think no one could prove - as yet - that what Sanders or Bugliosi wrote are lies or false, so I wouldn't buy that. Sorry. [/quote] Eran, I think you miss the finer point, here. The point of discounting any author is based upon ~you~ not having been there. Without you having first-hand knowledge of a particular event, how can you completely trust a written account of that event? I can start writing that I was present at Spahn Ranch and that I knew this person and that person and I heard them say this and I heard someone else say they had done that. If I can find a publisher to take the story and run with it, does that make any of it true? Remember, publishing fiction doesn't make it non-fiction. When someone tells me their story about an event, I have no way of knowing if or how they may have embellished the story, do I? Now if I repeat the story to you, you have no way of knowing if I am adding my own flavor to the story. Or, just as importantly, if I am leaving anything out. What we do know is that Ed Sanders came along after the fact, so anything he wrote is based on what someone else related to him. And without firsthand knowledge to know just how truthful his writings actually are, they have to be viewed as being questionable.
with the discussion going on about Voytek and that fact that everyone says he wasn't very ambitious ... it begs the question - was Voytek serious about dealing? Sure he met with Harrigan, Dawson and Doyle - and possibly others - sure he, Jay and Abigail seemed enmeshed with the whole drug culture but was it like everything else he did a pile of bs? Voytek was also telling everyone that he was a writer/screenwriter but did he ever actually publish or sell anything? It looks like he was going to ride the Folger gravy train until Abigail got up and smelled the coffee (I swear freudian slip). If he was going to sell MDA or whatever he was a dumb cookie because a junkie will only snort, shoot up or smoke his profits away... the smart dealers never touch the stuff I would imagine...
I couldn't have said it better Jean! And that's been my point, we don't really know how much he was dealing.
