Discussion in 'Physical Evidence from Jay Sebring' started by catscradle77, Apr 2, 2009.
The autopsy of Jay Sebring. He fought for his life and for that of the others.
Ok, I have a few questions, can anyone answer them? In the HS book, it says that Tex stabbed Jay in the back. When was he stabbed in the chest and who did it?
According to Tex's testimony, he and Pat were stabbing him. Who dealt what stab wounds I can not find:
A A guy started toward me and
Q Was this the man that had been on the couch?
A No, it was another person.
Q What happened then?
A And I wasI remember I was kind of running or jumping back and forth behind the couch and making funny noises and Sadie said, "Watch out" or something like that and I turned around and I emptied the gun on this man.
Q You say emptied the gun on this man?
Q How many times did you shoot him, if you know?
A I dont know. I just shot, you know. I dont know how many times I shot him.
Q Did you do anything else?
A Then I went around the couch and started stabbing him.
Q This is the same man that you shot?
A Yes. Patricia was already over there stabbing him and I went over and I did the same thing.
Q How long did that take or last?
A Until Sadie hollered at me and she was fighting and stabbing a man going out the door.
Interesting, I don't remember hearing this before. I don't think Pat has ever admitted to participating in his murder, has she? ???
It's assumed that this person is Voy, but considering the blood left on the porch, the evidence points to Jay. His blood doesn't look like it was from him being moved after death. That being said, the blood of Sharon's on the porch does look as if it could have been from her lying still, there is a pattern in the blood that looks like something was moved. Jays is more of a splatter.
With all that blood on the porch, Why would Susan go back in the house to retrieve blood for the writing on the wall? The pattern in the blood could be from where Susan soaked the blood in the towel from the front porch. Or it was from were Sharon was Moved? Notice the indention in the bush aswell. Why the dumb ass would lie about going back in the house is beyond me. To make it seem much worse I suppose? :'(
[quote author=dvs1572 link=topic=3868.msg33808#msg33808 date=1244755804]
It's assumed that this person is Voy, but considering the blood left on the porch, the evidence points to Jay.
[/quote]Interesting point, except Tex says that he was helping Pat stab Jay "until Sadie hollered at me and she was fighting and stabbing a man going out the door" so it doesn't seem like it could be Jay unless he was able to be in 2 places at the same time.
Please don't shoot me for thinking outloud, but what if, there wasn't that much blood on the porch, until supposedly, Manson, and whoever, supposedly came back later, and moved the bodies out there?, so she would've had to go back in to retrive blood, which would lead to thinking that Manson had to come back, to create such blood on the porch. I hope that makes sense to the subject, if not ignore me. LOL, Tammie
Why the blood evidence was never used in the defense is beyond me.
Fitzgerald brought it up in closing, but that is it.
Thanks, Cats - looks like Fitzgerals makes more sense than the Helter-Skelter theory -
Why would evidence be suppressed -
Why would no one have examined the contents of the trunks?
Why weren't the hands bagged? Or were they really so stoned out on something that was no able to be detected that no one ran until it was too late.
Why didn't Tex's statement about Pat stabbed Jay be not a part of the general scenario and time frame?
Why was Jay's blood also on the porch and the trunk.
I'm getting a migraine.
Report of chemical analysis states "date submited" as August 7th, 1969... Fuel for conspiration theories?
I think Jay and Sharon's other reports, or perhaps the LaBianca's were dated wrong as well.
What strikes me was how small Jay was. He only weighed 122lbs at the autopsy. When alive he probably only weighed a few more pounds than that. I saw elsewhere on the forum that Jay knew martial arts, taught to him by Bruce Lee. Now I am no brawler but had he not been shot he still would not have been a very formidable opponent to a large man like Tex Watson. If Jay had tried to fight back he wouldn't have stood a chance. If someone who weighed 122lbs hit me, who weighs 220lbs, it would have just anger the hell out of me. Frykowski would be a whole other matter but Sebring would not have offered that much of a challenge. Absent of the gun, his best defense would have been to run out of the house....he would have been hard to catch.
You are correct; when facing a gun it does not matter whether you know martial arts or Marshall Dillon, the odds are against you. But what did TW weigh at the time? 160-170? He was long and lanky, so his size could have been used against him. I do not see him running out. rather, he did what most would do, stay for the sake of those you care about, with the hopes of being able to defend them some how.
I noticed the date too and commented on it....somewhere!
For sure,Jay stuck around for Sharon,his last words,before Tex shot him,were "Can't you see she's (Sharon) pregnant"?